Talk:Leviamon

Ainz, I need you to check this translation, as I am completely unwilling to use it right now:

Called the "Devil Beast" out of terror of the exceedingly mighty power that this monster possesses, it is counted as one of the "Seven Great Demon Lords" and is the strongest monster existing in the Digital World. This extensive monster, possessing gigantic jaws said to be able to guzzle even the Digital World, is reported to sleep in the deeps of the Net Ocean near to the Dark Area, and if one time it is awakened it will look down on any kind of Digimon to the fullest, not to mention other Demon Lord Digimon, but it is said it will run away in horror from Angel Digimon. However, as the existence of the limits on Digimon are decoded, its own appears similar to nothingness, and it is said that it builds the foundation for the existence of wickedness in the Digital World. Its Special Moves are destroying everything with its gigantic jaws (Rostrum), and mowing everything down with its long tail (Cauda).

I'm fairly confident about everything not in italics, but the whole "despise" bit just sounds so completely awkward...but I can't figure out what else it could mean.

It could be that "it is the most contemptible of any Digimon, and will run away in fear from Angel Digimon, let alone other Demon Lord Digimon", which honestly seems like it would work better, but doesn't fit with it being the strongest of the SGDL. If you're not having any more luck with this than me, though, that's what I'd go with. KrytenKoro06 08:46, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

The problem with that is that "any Digimon" is clearly the subject of the contempt...maybe...maybe it despises any

ENVY!!!

"It despises any Digimon at the top, and will flee even Angel Digimon, much less other Demon Lord Digimon"

Called the "Devil Beast" out of terror of the exceedingly mighty power that this monster possesses, it is counted as one of the "Seven Great Demon Lords" and is the strongest monster existing in the Digital World. This extensive monster, said to possess gigantic jaws which could guzzle even the Digital World, is reported to sleep in the dephts of the Net Ocean nearest to the Dark Area, and if it is awakened, it will despise any Digimon at the top, and will flee even Angel Digimon, much less other Demon Lord Digimon. However, as the existence of the limits on Digimon are decoded, its own appears similar to nothingness, and it is said that it builds the foundation for the existence of wickedness in the Digital World. Its Special Moves are destroying everything with its gigantic jaws (Rostrum), and mowing everything down with its long tail (Cauda).

I'm having similar problems, I've even tried forcing the sentence fit to relate to its "strength" to get something like "...once awakened, it will despise any Digimon at the top, and is said that other Demon Lord Digimon fear it, and will even flee, not to mention Angel Digimon...", but that goes completely against the whole structure/syntax of the sentence. Other that that, I'm getting similar results to yours for that particular section, so probably "It despises any Digimon at the top, and will flee even Angel Digimon, much less than other Demon Lord Digimon" would be the most appropriate to go with --Ainz 11:17, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

DMA's one:

Known as the "Devil's Beast" out of fear due to his mighty powers, this monster is counted within the Digital World as one of the Seven Great Demon Lords. Many are informed that he sleeps and lives at the bottom of the Net Ocean's Dark Area, and his grandiosity and huge chin looms down above other Digimon, and some are told that he could engulf the entire Digital World if he wants to; out of the Seven Great Demon Lords, however, he is the most cowardly and will run away even if his opponent is an Angel type Digimon. However, this Digimon's existence is a must for decoders, with some claiming that he is the root of all evil and some suggesting that he is currently building a nest within the Digital World! His special attacks are "Rostrum", which slams down his chin onto the opponent, and "Cauda", which destroys everything in his path with his wicked whip-like tails.

--Lightlowemon 14:19, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

The DMA's one is very flawed to begin with, there's a lot of grammatical inaccuracies from it being almost entirely generated from a translation engine and also there are some words in there that don't exist in the text at all. --Ainz 16:11, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

Is Leviamon scary or scared?

https://wikimon.net/index.php?title=Leviamon&diff=416892&oldid=416643

Summarizing a discussion from discord, here are some of the localized translations:

• DRB: "If awoken, Leviamon will look down on any Digimon in positions of might, causing Angel Digimon to flee in terror, along with other Evil King Digimon. "
• Cyber Sleuth: " When awakened, it looks down upon all others, and even other evil king and angel Digimon flee in fear."
• links: "If awakened from its slumber, it would despise any high-ranking Digimon and wouldn't run away from even Angel Digimon, let alone other Evil King Digimon."
• next order: "from fear of the monster's powerful strength"

However, in my opinion these are not consistent with the grammar, and paint a picture of Leviamon at odds with its lore (ex. see Digimon Knuckles).

他の魔王型デジモン (Other demon lord digimon) はおろか (Let alone) 天使型デジモンでさえ (Even angel digimon) 恐れ逃げ出すと言われている。(It is said will flee in terror)

恐れ逃げ出す is a compound verb formed from

• 恐れ[P]; 虞[P]; 畏れ; 怖れ 【おそれ】 (n) fear; horror; anxiety; concern; uneasiness; reverence; [P] [Links]
• 逃げ出す[P] 【にげだす】 (v5s,vi) (1) to run away; to flee; to make off; to take to one's heels; to escape; (v5s,vi) (2) to start to run away; [P] [Links] [Sch]

The object of nigedasu is what you are fleeing from, and the subject is who is doing the fleeing. In this clause, "even angel Digimon" appears to be the object, not the subject, although I can't find many examples of similar construction to confirm. The closest I've seen is "光でさえ逃げ出すことができなくなる" (even light cannot escape), which could suggest that the angels are the subject of the clause.

The way those sources translate it indicates pride, not envy. And it doesn't make sense with the "let alone" and "even". It appears that they're splitting "haoroka" (let alone) into "ha" (making other demon lords the subject) and "oroka" (foolish). If we do it their approach, the line would be "When awakened, it looks down upon all others, and it said that other demon lord digimon and even foolish angel digimon flee in terror."

"foolish" doesn't make sense there. If it's a huge threat, it makes sense to flee. Hell, "even" doesn't make sense there because you'd expect angels to flee before other demon lords do. And none of that makes sense with the first part of the sentence -- that it will despise all those at the top. If everyone's running away from him, then how are those two thoughts logically connected?

From what I'm seeing in the grammar, the profile is indicating that Leviamon is so consumed by contempt that it can't stand to be around those other digimon. In my version, the "even" and "let alone" make sense in context -- it would make sense to flee the demon lords, who are mighty, but they are placed as much less remarkable than its behavior to angel digimon -- that's why "even" makes sense there. The English drb translation and the game translations neglect "oroka" entirely, and shuffle around "even" in a way that doesnt justify the structure of the juxtaposition, nor the first half of the sentence. They also ignore how the first half is targeted at high-ranking digimon, in tune with the sin of envy. He envies other digimon. He's not prideful, seeing them as beneath him. He's mad at them for being high-ranked.

The edit linked above did not cite translation errors, and seemed to just be based on the editor's common sense -- but common sense isn't always what's being followed with Digimon lore, and even though the English translations have similar interpretations of the direction of fear, they differ on other parts of the sentence, indicating they struggled with it too.. I'm an amateur and I'm happy to be corrected by someone fluent in Japanese.

In summary -- if those kana are meant to be read as one term, "haoroka", then leviamon remains the subject of the clause and he's the one fleeing in contempt. If it's "ha oroka", then the drb translation still needs some tweaking, and it's omitting that the angel digimon are being called clownish. As far as I can tell, it would also portray leviamon as justifiably proud, rather than envious. Again, the grammar is tricky here and Bandai isn't always faithful to real-world lore (most relevantly, Lilithmon's profile depicts it as inspiring Lust rather than being consumed by it), so a second opinion by a fluent speaker would be useful. For now, I propose that the most reasonable reading is that Leviamon is consumed by its Envy for high-ranking Digimon, despite its practical strength. If the angels and demon lords are the subject of the verb instead of its object, then I think the clause should be "if it is awakened, it will despise any Digimon at the top, and even Angel Digimon will flee from it, much less other Demon Lord Digimon."KrytenKoro06 (talk) 14:23, 26 March 2025 (CDT)

none of it feels like Leviamon should be running away like a little scaredy cry baby though. Thst doesn’t fit one of the 7 most evil digimon at all. If hes leaving cus he hated them, that’s not fear. Running away crying cus he’s scared just doesn’t fit at all whys a cry baby coward in the sgdl? People scared of him is more reasonable. “and will flee even Angel Digimon, much less other Demon Lord Digimon. ” can 100% be read to mean “it will cause those guys to flee from him”. Changing the verb shows that “and will kill/stab/punch/eat even Angel Digimon, much less other Demon Lord Digimon. ” I’d say he’s scary and you have to localise the wording as it doesn’t properly translate in English as it makes him seem cowardly. Muur (talk) 18:36, 26 March 2025 (CDT)

I'm on Kryten's side on this one, since he knows how to translate things, though certainly it would be good to have a second opinion from a qualified person. Possibly apropos to this discussion, in its Cyber Sleuth boss battle Leviamon says, "噛み合わせを気にしている..." My amateurish translation of that was, "I'm worried about grinding my teeth...", which might fit in with Leviamon being somewhat neurotic, but I'd be interested to learn if there's a more accurate way to translate it. --TMS (talk) 21:04, 26 March 2025 (EDT)

well hes admitted error that official translations have corrected before, like with Creepymon and Ancientgreymon which is prorbably why hes looking for other opinions as the official translation could be right this time too (and has been consistently transalting it this way)Muur (talk) 21:50, 26 March 2025 (CDT)

はおろか with 愚か(foolish) meaning does not make sense here, and if it is 愚か it should also take な. This はおろか is 100% the 'not to mention/let alone' sense. Also the angel Digimon are the subject of 逃げ出す, the Angels are the ones fleeing. 逃げ出す is intransitive so it does not take an object (if you want to relate it to the thing the subject is running from you have to use から). My personal take: "It is said that once it is awakened, it looks down on all Digimon no matter how high they may rank, such that even Angel Digimon flee from it in fear, let alone other Demon Lord Digimon." I dunno about the English word choice for 'looks down' though there might be a better vocab, I get it fits the 'envy' but personally the sensing I get is it is referring to Leviamon towering/overpowering over other Digimon causing them to flee in fear. --Garmmon (talk) 07:39, 1 April 2025 (CDT)

Responses:

"(and has been consistently transalting it this way"

Part of the reason I'm asking is they weren't actually doing that. For example, look at Links. They have had the same overarching framing of Leviamon being scary, but they attack the grammar in different ways.

"噛み合わせを気にしている..."

"I'm worried about my bite..." (ex. http://www.tokyodentistry.com/bite/)

"逃げ出す is intransitive so it does not take an object (if you want to relate it to the thing the subject is running from you have to use から)."

This is the clarification I was hoping for, thanks! It doesn't make a ton of sense to me thematically but the grammar is clear now. I suppose they're doing a subversion like Lilithmon.

"I dunno about the English word choice for 'looks down' though there might be a better vocab,"

Some other synonyms could be "scorns", "condescends", "disdains", or a bit punishly, "turns snout up at". I'd maybe suggest "scorn".KrytenKoro06 (talk) 11:09, 1 April 2025 (CDT)