Talk:Sunarizamon (Liberator)

evolution sources

if evolution sources dont count, why do we count tcg digixros as a form of evolution? thts summoning digimon, then putting soruces under it (and the tcg doesnt count it as evo).Muur (talk) 20:43, 14 December 2024 (CST)

Because DigiXros is a kind of evolution in the rest of the franchise, even if by game mechanics (and technically even inside Xros Wars itself) is considered a separate thing. Meanwhile, what you want is randomly accepting anything as an evolution when the Digimon never took that form. --Blaze Dragon (talk) 07:45, 15 December 2024 (CST)

I would argue that only what works as evolution in a given context should be counted as evolution. For example, we don't count all of the Jogresses from DW2, Tag Tamers, or D1 Tamers that result in a Digimon of a lower level or an egg. Therefore, neither the DCG's DigiXros mechanic nor whatever Muur is doing would be counted. --TMS (talk) 13:05, 15 December 2024 (EST)

I have to disagree here for DigiXros. We consider it for Digimon Xros Wars, where it essentially works as the main evolution method of the series even if it's counted as something else. If we don't count it in one, we shouldn't count it anywhere, and by that point you may as well remove AppGattai as well since those also are something different from evolution. Evolution is just going from a Digimon to another, it's fine to keep DigiXros in general in, especially considering the sheer amount of work KiraraKidohara put in tracking all the possibilities, and how Liberator shows it used to progress to a following stage with no real difference in how it'd show an evolution. --Blaze Dragon (talk) 16:40, 15 December 2024 (CST)

Maybe I don't understand the game's mechanic, then. What do you mean about how Liberator shows it? What chapter was that? --TMS (talk) 17:45, 15 December 2024 (EST)

DEBUG.5-1 from the novel. Horaiji uses DigiXros in his deck to get out a Chimairamon (and intended to do the same for a Millenniumon, but ultimately didn't go through with it). The actual mechanic in the game is not counted as an evolution (the player doesn't draw a card for doing it and it doesn't trigger On Evolve effects) but I feel that's unimportant in comparison to how it still effectively accomplishes the same as an evolution and how it's the main evolution method in Xros Wars (to the point of being outright referred to as a "legendary evolution" early in the manga). --Blaze Dragon (talk) 21:24, 15 December 2024 (CST)

I don't think anyone is disputing that DigiXros is a type of evolution in Xros Wars. This question specifically concerns the DCG's version of DigiXros, which is seemingly not quite the same thing, just as Jogress in Digimon World 2 is not Jogress in its usual sense, or how terms like Digimental and Digimemory can mean different things in different contexts. The DCG mechanic looks less like evolution and more like a way to play a Digimon more cheaply. Not all of their presumed components are even required, and in some cases it's a devolution (in terms of evolutionary level) rather than forward progression. For all those reasons, I don't think it should be counted. I am very thankful for all of KiraraKidohara's hard work, but I just don't think the DCG's DigiXros counts as evolution. --TMS (talk) 23:53, 15 December 2024 (EST)

"Evolution is just going from a Digimon to another" which is not whats happening in the tcg. kimeramon came out, then horaji put three deltamon under it with the digixros ability. no deltamon turned into kimeramon. if a guy has shoutmon as his partner, then uses digixros to get shoutmon x7 - would we list ballistamon, dorulumon and the others to be forms of that shoutmon? when pyramidimon came out, he used his ability to put golemon under him. which is the same as what happens with digixros. you said yourself how the tcg doesnt consider it evolution and "Evolution sources do not count." also applies to the evolution sources added via digixrosing. so ye. in digimon dawn/dusk, you can fuse metalgreymon with omnimon to get wargreymon, but that isnt listed on this wiki. but even then, the tcg is *very* explicit that digixros is *not* evolution in the tcg. i woludnt be shocked if applink works similar to digixros.Muur (talk) 23:39, 15 December 2024 (CST)

I see the main difference as a matter of materials. DigiXros is formed from multiple materials, so those materials become the new Digimon. In the case of that Chimairamon, it specifies three Deltamon (of different card numbers, but that's irrelevant here) as materials to form it, so you could say that Chimairamon (pseudo?)-evolved from the three Deltamon, but the three Deltamon obviously didn't evolve from each other, as much as MetalGarurumon didn't evolve from the Agumon line when forming Omegamon through Jogress. You put Shoutmon X7 as an example which is actually a great one, since that's one seen in both the Xros Wars anime and manga: Shoutmon X7 is considered an evolution of (Omega)Shoutmon, (Zeke)Greymon, Ballistamon, Dorulumon, Starmons and Sparrowmon, but obviously the actual materials are separate Digimon without a connection to each other. Basically, I see DigiXros as essentially the same as a Jogress but with multiple materials, which is how the wiki has classified it thus far and I see no reason to change it. Meanwhile, adding evolution sources is just that, adding to a stack, the Digimon never take that form unless a Devolution effect comes into play. --Blaze Dragon (talk) 12:36, 16 December 2024 (CST)

the deltamon did not turn into kimeramon. tms's mention digimon world 2 is relevant: since that has you jogress backwards in all instances. tcg xros is not evolution, thats all there is to say about it. Muur (talk) 19:12, 16 December 2024 (CST)